B-Side Morning Brew w/ Bij & Niles

Announcer
0:00:00
This is a KUNV Studios original program.

Wes Knight
0:00:04
The content of this program does not reflect the views or opinions of 91.5 Jazz & More, the University of Nevada Las Vegas, or the Board of Regents of the Nevada System of Higher Education.

Niles
0:00:15
Good morning and welcome.

Niles
0:00:16
You're listening to B-Side Morning Brew with Beef and Niles. Hot coffee, cool chatting, chillin' on the corner of Lifestyle Ave and Music Street. On 91.5 KUNV Jazz and More.

Chipmunk Voice
0:00:38
Good morning my man.

Chipmunk Voice
0:00:39
Good morning man. Good. Let's start with our sip of coffee.

Niles
0:00:42
Here we go. Oh yeah, oh yeah.

Chipmunk Voice
0:00:44
That's it.

Niles
0:00:45
We're just going right in my friend.

Niles
0:00:46
For those that are just joining us, we're deep in the middle of this conversation about the new Andre 3000, who I think is cool. Right?

Bijon
0:01:01
Oh, well, you know, some might consider him a legend, iconic in that genre, in the rap genre, outcast, and one of the most infamous, famous party songs. The reality is that it's interesting. As we are wont to do, well first of all, hello my friend. you know, encapsulating our conversation into our Morton Brew construct here. Yeah.

Bijon
0:01:42
You know, I don't think many of our listeners realize that about 90% of the conversations that Niles and I have never really makes it to air. And it's probably some of the most compelling radio show content that we have. We're like, why didn't we record this? I think we're going to end, I think we're just going to be, become vloggers, right? Hmm. Haven't heard that in a while.

Bijon
0:02:10
Right? Yeah.

Niles
0:02:11
I know, that's going deep, right? It's going back.

Bijon
0:02:15
Going back. Uh oh. Not that we are necessarily of that age, at least in our minds anyway. But yeah. But yeah, so this is yet another one of our conversations that we have decided to actually encapsulate for you, our listeners, and we're always... and not anxious. That's not the word I'm looking for. We are always excited.

Niles
0:02:40
Excited?

Bijon
0:02:41
Yes, excited to share with you what goes on in the minds of Niles Thomas and B. John Watson.

Niles
0:02:49
Of this nonsense. Yes. Well going back to the Andre 3000 thing, right? We're going to get into what you're asking your students at Berkeley, right? The funny thing is, the first time I experienced Andre 3000 or Andre Lauren Benjamin, was the Guy Ritchie film called Revolver. And I'm like, I think it's a great film. I feel like Guy Ritchie's films, I mean, come on,

Niles
0:03:21
that's a really good film. But I was thinking, like, God, he looks familiar and he's just like this cool cat, who is this guy? Then I come to find out who he is musically, whom I never was introduced to. You know what I mean?

Niles
0:03:34
It's not my bag, you know, so but Anyway, tell the audience so you're teaching the kids at Berkeley and they're off to go see Andre 3000 concert right now, right? exactly, so

Bijon
0:03:47
Andre 3000 had received an honorary doctorate from Berkeley College of Music last year He's actually doing a concert the Wang Center here in Boston tomorrow or this week, whatever, and so he's doing a panel discussion at Berkeley today. And so a few of my students were in my harmony class. They're like, 150,000

Bijon
0:04:26
on campus. And I saw the line building outside of the theater there at the Performing Arts Center. The theater. nothing. They said, you're the old man. Did you know that that Andre 3000 did a, you know, this new age jazz flute album?

Bijon
0:04:45
I said, as a matter of fact, I was very well aware of that. But I'm like, do you even know where Andre 3000, what his original band was? And one of the students eagerly raised their hand, and they're like, Outkast. And I'm like, you do realize that Outkast

Bijon
0:05:00
was around before you were born?

Niles
0:05:03
Mm-hmm.

Bijon
0:05:04
You know?

Niles
0:05:04
Yeah, yeah.

Bijon
0:05:06
They're like, yeah, I never really thought of it that way. I was like, exactly.

Niles
0:05:09
But you brought up a good question about, would these kids go see a quote-unquote flautist if it wasn't Andre 3000? And I think the answer would be no, for the most part it'd be no, but because

Bijon
0:05:40
Andre 3000 has that body of work from the past and has that influence and cool and now doing something left So when I asked the question, I said, like you said, I said, so if you know, if you had just heard this, you didn't know who Andre 3000 was, and you would just heard this music, would you listen to it? And one of them answered, Yeah, yeah. I was like, really?

Bijon
0:05:59
No, you wouldn't. I said, I said, I just want you to be honest. We're in the cone of truth here in this class. He said, yeah, you're probably right. No, I wouldn't listen to it. I said, that's fine. I said, listen, I'm not trying to say you're any less than for listening to it.

Bijon
0:06:15
Of course, you're intrigued by it, right? So it breaks up. He said, all of you one day plan to be artists, right? You're going to Berklee College of Music. You plan to get into the entertainment industry in one way, shape, or form. You know, honestly, you should look at what Andre 3000 is doing as a blueprint for, here's

Bijon
0:06:35
a cat that has been doing this for decades. As a result of the following he has built, he has the luxury of being able to put out an album that is truly a reflection of where he is at artistically.

Niles
0:06:53
Yeah.

Bijon
0:06:54
Now, whether you like it or not, that's a whole other discussion.

Niles
0:06:57
And unapologetically so. In terms of I've watched those...

Bijon
0:07:00
Yes, that's the perfect word.

Bijon
0:07:01
Unapologetically.

Niles
0:07:02
Yeah, I've watched his interviews and he's so cool about it, you know, because the questions are, you know, there's such a departure from what you do, blah, blah, blah. Look, listen, I don't, I don't, I really don't care what you think. I'm just doing what I do. I'm into this. And so if you're into it, cool, and if you're not into it, cool. It just doesn't matter. That really is an important message today in terms of, you know, I don't care what age you are,

Niles
0:07:27
honestly, whether you're younger, learning, getting into the artist industry, or being a musician, to how long you've been doing it. Nowadays we live in this time where, I mean people could always tell if you're not honest with what's going on, but nowadays it's more so than ever I think.

Niles
0:07:50
And so the idea is like just do what you do and if people like it, great, and if they don't, great. It doesn't matter, but just do what you love. But do it because you genuinely want to do it, not because you think someone's gonna like something, you know. It doesn't work.

Bijon
0:08:04
It doesn't work. Right. I mean, literally, the first track on his album is, I swear, I really wanted to make a rap, quote-unquote, rap album. Yeah. But this is,

Niles
0:08:17
this is how the wind blew. Yeah. Well, and he said, I've seen him in interviews talking about how he just doesn't have anything to say lyrically. He has something to say musically with this new instrument. He's like, I'm not going to, as he calls it, spit a rhyme if I've got nothing to say lyrically. Because I've sat, I've tried to compose lyrics and I don't have anything to say. That's a value. Because when I do, I will put that kind of record together. And that's genius too. That's almost, you know, whether he thinks this or not, but that's genius marketing also.

Niles
0:08:58
Exactly. By the way, I'll be back with the things that you're familiar with at some point, but I'm not making any promises, you know, so you better come see my Laotis concert, you know,

Bijon
0:09:12
it's genius. New blue sun, you know, crazy. Ambient new age spiritual jazz, that's what that's how the industry has coined it.

Niles
0:09:24
Yes, yeah, they got to use something to, you know, advertise, market, sell their product. You got to use some sort of word, you know, put it into a genre.

Bijon
0:09:39
Pretty amazing. But you know, it goes into, I mean, we talked about just understanding, that listen, we do this for a reason. And the reason is not necessarily to make money. The reason is because we have to do it.

Niles
0:09:58
Right.

Bijon
0:09:58
Friends and mentors in the business who passed away unfortunately way too soon. Roy Hargrove. Yes. Phenomenal trumpet player, flugelhorn, amazing writer, composer. Writer. Composer.

Bijon
0:10:15
You know, he would go to jam sessions until four in the morning at Smalls in New York City. Wherever he was touring, he would just show up at jam sessions and just play.

Niles
0:10:26
And even without getting paid.

Bijon
0:10:28
Without getting paid, exactly. And really, through that, encouraged a whole range of musicians over the course of his lifetime. By him being there and just being so pure in his desire to make music and make art.

Niles
0:10:53
It's interesting, everybody has their own story, every musician, artist that we talk to, but it's interesting where those lines get blurred and why they become blurred. My only thought in theory is that, look, when I was younger I got into music and you get a band together and everybody's in it, like let's sleep on the couch on the floor do these little tours you go or you do what you need to do But everybody's all in right as we get older, right? You gotta you got to make a living bills car payments your rent back then, you know

Niles
0:11:27
Whatever you're gonna do and so it becomes a job Right if you want to do that music and if you're gonna be a session player music, you know Whether it's live session playing or recording session player, at one point does it not become about the music anymore and it's just about the paycheck. Walk into a studio or walk into a session, a live session, go I'll take the gig because I'm going to make X amount of dollars. That's what's disheartening. The reality of that is disheartening because,

Niles
0:11:57
and then as we get older, we go back to going, well wait a minute, this isn't about the money. It's some weird dichotomy, I guess.

Bijon
0:12:05
I mean, the reality is that you and I have this conversation all the time. I mean, I come from that studio session player – what's the word I'm looking for? Community, if you will. But I also am fortunate enough to be able to understand the importance of being an artist. And so that, as a result, it's made me a better session player because I want to bring these other influences of being

Bijon
0:12:35
an artist into a session and not just show up and punch a clock and just play like an automaton. And actually, the reason why I get called is because I'm willing to bring something to help

Niles
0:12:49
the artist that's recording. Yeah, that's a fine line too. Do you remember there was a... he was young at the time, he was a kid we used to hire when we did those shows in New York and Boston a few number of years ago and

Niles
0:13:17
he ended up moving to LA. Great bass player, man, great. Do you remember we were having him... we started to bring him on But he kept, it was just like, well what's the bread, what's the bread? Even when we told him, you know, what's the bread?

Niles
0:13:20
Am I going to do this with the bread, with the bread, with the bread? And after a while we're like, you know what man? As the employer, you're going to keep asking that, then after a while for us it's like, well you're not in this for the music. And we understand the hybrid,

Niles
0:13:32
of course we understand the hybrid of it's for the music and for the bread. But at that point it was just about the bread. It's like, we're not going to hire this kid anymore. You're done. You're done. In terms of us hiring you. We don't want that. We don't want that vibe. If it's just for the punching in for the time clock, good luck with that.

Bijon
0:13:55
Well, and as a result, we see in the industry now that so much of an emphasis is just on how do we make something viral? How do we get that short-term gain from a monetization standpoint as opposed to really being focused on sharing something that is artistically important to the artist at the core?

Niles
0:14:15
Yeah, and what's the big picture look like for you? Do you know what I mean? If you're not thinking about that, then you're gonna misstep as you go along, you're just going to screw up, potentially burn bridges and that kind of thing.

Niles
0:14:29
It's tough.

Niles
0:14:31
It's tough to know that too when you are mid, late 20s into your early 30s. We know some early 30s and I don't miss that. Man, I do not miss being at that age and trying to figure out who you are, what you're doing. I got to get here and I got to do that.

Niles
0:14:48
Oh man, I don't miss that anxiety of...

Bijon
0:14:52
And some might say that we have, because of our experience, we're able to take a look back, you know, they say hindsight's always 20-20. By the same token, I like to think I'm trying to mentor some of these younger players into understanding that time, what you think takes a long time to build is not. Didn't we have that conversation? We were like, yeah, you know, oh, yeah, it's a three year process. Well, it went by in a blink of an eye.

Niles
0:15:20
Yeah. And at the at the at the top of that three years, you're just like, I know how am I going to get through this in three years or stay focused for three years or but yeah, you look back on three years like, where did that go? Exactly. You know, especially in today's times, oddly enough, the clock seems to be... It's ticking faster. Yeah, it's just weird.

Niles
0:15:43
And I guess it's because we're all... I don't care what industry you're in, but we all live in different months. We're all two, three months ahead of ourselves, you know, scheduling things and doing things. And I get it, but it's not helping at the same time.

Bijon
0:15:59
Well, but at its core, if you show a level of discipline, no matter what you do, being disciplined and focused on what's important. And I think people just don't take time to reflect on what is important to them. When you do finally find what's important to you and you can focus on that, then you start really seeing results and reaping dividends. Absolutely.

Niles
0:16:22
Yeah. And not, you know, your schedule of events changes. Things that you want done at a certain time period in your life just gets altered. It changes. Meaning it may not plan. The date you want something to happen may not be that date.

Niles
0:16:38
Again, you and I, when you're 40-ish, I remember you were trying to get the gig at Berklee, man. It just wasn't happening. And John Clayton told you, it ain't your time, man. And when it's time, Berkeley will reach out to you. And that was a day for you was so hard.

Niles
0:16:59
I was there. And now look, you're just like, yeah, whatever. I'm at Berkeley. You know what I'm saying? It's like, but now's your time. It wasn't then.

Niles
0:17:08
And it's so hard for any of us to swallow those moments. It's like the wind being knocked out of your sail on such scales, you know, you're like man It's a it's interesting, but that's a testament to You just got to stay the course, you know, you just got to stay the course and I was giving you praise good good

Bijon
0:17:28
Yeah, well that being said I think it's time for a little music, you know, I'm in the shed a little bit, as the old heads would say. I'm in the shed practicing a lot more than I normally do in preparation for some guest artist things I have coming up. And really been digging into some, you know, everyone knows me as El Toro, you know, I'm in your face, you know, bombastic, bringing the heat, the sizzle. But I'm really going into a more reflective side in my playing, which exists, by the way.

Bijon
0:18:08
And this is a tune that I've been working on that, once again, another favorite of mine, Miles Davis. This is a tune entitled, It Never Entered My Mind, off of the Miles Davis Quintet album.

Niles
0:18:25
Let's check it out. You're listening to it here on B-Side Morning Brew with Beej and Niles a 91.5 K UNV jazz and more

Niles
0:18:32
so so Oh so so?

Niles
0:19:26
? so so so

Niles
0:20:58
Welcome back. You're listening to B-Side Morning Brew with Beej and Niles here on 91.5 KUNV Jazz and More. That was Miles Davis and his quintet. It never entered my mind. I'm proud of you, man. This is normally not what, you know, I know you to listen to in terms of a bit haunting for you, you know what I mean? That's my bag, generally. But this thing's all over the map, isn't it? I mean, it is. It's beautiful man. It starts out with a classical kind of idea, then goes into a haunting vibe. Very romantic even, I'd say. Yeah.

Niles
0:24:35
Wow. Good on you. I like it. Alright everybody, let's give B. John Watson a round of applause.

Niles
0:24:44
Laughter.

Niles
0:24:52
You're listening to something else. This is great. Very cool. Man, beautiful.

Bijon
0:25:00
Yeah, I mean, again, here's a testament to, you know, as an artist, listening to different styles within the genre that you love. Right? I think so. Or even outside of the genre. I mean, you know, I listen to a whole lot of different stuff. goes back to you have to bring your

Niles
0:25:21
totality of your experience, your experiences to be creative as an artist and so that's part of it. Yeah, it's an interesting thing. Well, as an artist, it's good to be open to all sorts of genres and

Niles
0:25:53
kind of be influenced and inspired by all sorts to bring into

Bijon
0:26:03
You're back at tricks so to speak I think in terms of hearing Session players to me the best are the ones That can just reach into anything. You know that says something. You know it's interesting Absolutely, that's what we're here for I mean now. We're at a stage in our careers where we are You don't realize it.

Bijon
0:26:06
And mentoring doesn't necessarily mean meeting one-on-one, but just inspiring people to keep creating and going in new directions. I mean, you look at the body of work and the things you produce and the people you produce from country music to rock, to pop, to rap. You know, rap, you know what I'm saying? So, I mean, there's something that's what it's about.

Bijon
0:26:31
And that doesn't happen. People don't come to you for that unless you have shown an ability to bring the best out of people and being creative. And that requires an expanse of knowledge to be able to extract that from people.

Niles
0:26:47
Yeah.

Niles
0:26:48
And that's a whole other high wire balancing act.

Bijon
0:26:53
And it comes down to there's no substitute for experience.

Niles
0:26:56
You can have all the chops in the world, but if you don't have the experience, it doesn't really matter. Yeah, man. No, it's cool. It's interesting. It's exploration, I think, is what it is. In the music world, it's good to be an explorer kind of idea. Explorer. You know I mean it really is. I'm all about it. You know I mean look even as you know the stuff I'm doing now venturing more into the rockabilly and swing thing which I've always loved it but I never tried it you know and it just so happens guitar wise I'm more natural at it than I would have thought but that could be years of

Niles
0:27:32
me listening to Stray Cats those kind of bands you know. But you wouldn't have known that unless you tried it. Yeah, you have to be willing to try something That's that's at the end of the day. That's the bottom line and hence going back to Andre 3000 You know, he's just like I'm gonna try something completely different cuz I'm someone gave me a flute and I'm interested in Exploring this and see where it takes me, you know It's great. Well, we were filming movies and stuff Yeah, between filming well being an artist, right?

Niles
0:28:02
It's just being a true artist, trying out different mediums, which I think is cool. Well, close us out, brother.

Niles
0:28:10
Close us out.

Bijon
0:28:11
Hey, that's our message for today. Always work on authenticity and integrity in whatever you do. Be disciplined. You will see the results. Twenty years ago or more, when Niles and I first met, I don't think doing a radio show was on our radar at all.

Niles
0:28:32
Twenty-five years ago.

Bijon
0:28:34
Yeah, you know, at least. So yeah, we're happy to be here. We're happy to share these thoughts with you. We're thrilled that you take the time to listen to us ramble and blab. We're happy and thrilled and thrilled and happy and thrilled happy and happy and thrilled It's really burgers and beers and buckets of bagels. We just really appreciate the happiness and the

Bijon
0:28:57
Thrilled that you're happy and I'm happy On that note we wish you all a very happy Sunday And we'd like to thank our media partners 91.5 KUMB jazz and more and all of you as well. And if you're interested in finding out what's going on, feel free to go to thejazzrepublic.com. Good morning, everybody. Enjoy your Sunday. Have a great weekend.

Niles
0:29:24
You've been listening to B-Side Morning Brew with Bij and Niles, You've been listening to B-Side Morning Brew with Bij and Niles,

Bijon
0:29:28
Chilling on the corner of Lifestyle Ave and Music Street on 91.5 KUNV Jazz and More.